Former Navy Seal - JP Dinnell

Joining the podcast this week is former Navy Seal and Chief Training Officer and Leadership Instructor, Speaker and Strategic Advisor with Echelon Front, where he serves as Chief Training Officer. J.P. is also a pro team athlete and spokesperson for Origin Maine and Jocko Fuel, an American clothing and supplement company.

We chat about his childhood, BUDS training and what inspired him to become a Sniper in the Navy Seals and those who inspired him, which included Chris Kyle.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Good morning, good afternoon, or good evening, wherever you're listening. Uh it's Layton from the We Happy Few History on Your Doorstep podcast for your latest episode. And I have got a former Navy SEAL with me today, one which I never thought would ever happen in my lifetime, um, for a number of reasons, which I'll probably talk about as I go on. But I have JP Donnell with me. How are you, JP? I'm great. How are you, Leighton? I'm all right, thank. It's a bit warm here. I'm not sure. Yeah, it's very warm. We've had a a red weather warning on our phone apps today because of the weather. It's we're hitting our peak summer. It's all downhill from this week. Okay. What is the peak summer for you? When it's hot, when people rush out to the shops and buy fans, which they probably bought last year, and then threw out when it got too cold, and then gone back up against it.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

So I live in the Dallas Fort Worth area of Texas. So that's why I asked what is hot, because uh we'll we'll be over, you know, during the summer. I mean, it gets over a hundred degrees Fahrenheit regularly, and that's just that's just how the summers are.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

It's I've got a friend who lives in Fort Worth. We didn't just uh you know, yes, uh he's a American Airlines pilot, uh Taco Bell. He's a marine veteran uh colonel. Oh, right. He's in he's in Fort Fort Worth. That's cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Well, I fly with them often, so maybe uh you can get us connected later, and that would be cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:28

He's a great guy, and he you know, he has veterans on his he does a podcast as well, Tall Tales with Taco or Taco Tuesdays or something like that. And so he has veterans on all the time. That's awesome. He's he's a honestly you'll love him. And yeah, there will be no time difference issues either. So it's a winner. That works. Uh JP, I mean Yeah, I gotta thank again Ben Duff for for hugging this up. He's a great guy. And when he said, you know, we had um able to um link me up with Rob Jones uh a few weeks ago, which was phenomenal. I think I spared read his book as well. Really incredible story. Um and obviously then he mentioned yourself. And how can I say no to a to a navy seal um for a number of reasons. I mean, you're a sniper, so I don't know how far your range is. Um but I've also I've I've been in awe of the Navy SEALs since I was a young lad. Um, even growing up in where I'm from, I don't know what it is because the PR machine for the Navy SEALs is very different for the Marines. I don't know why, but you know, the you know, I'm not even American and I wanted to be U US Marine watching every, you know, that popped up, you know, because the PR machine is incredible. But the Navy SEALs, I think I always felt like you guys were saying special. Um and I think it comes down to the training and and and and boot camp and what you go through. Um, I always think of the term is it wet and sandy.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

Yes, yeah, yeah. Wet and sandy as you're going through buds. And and and I I I love what you said about just the the PR machine because uh it's great because had I my brother Corey and I not watched you know this old school documentary back in the day when we were little kids about the SEAL teams, um, I wouldn't have known about the SEAL teams. Now I knew about Army Rangers, you know, Delta Force, Marine Corps, obviously. I had family that was in the Air Force, so I knew about the Air Force and Air Force Pararescue, which is their special forces. Uh, and then I learned about the SEAL teams at a young age. And, you know, I was infatuated with the military in general. You know, both of my grandfathers served in World War II, uh, Korean War, Vietnam War. Um, you know, my my dad's dad was uh in the Navy in World War II. You know, he's an old farmer from uh not at the time, but he was a young farmer from Nebraska uh and joined the Navy when he was 16 years old to fight in World War II. Um, you know, did his four years, uh, was in some pretty hellacious battles uh on a destroyer up in the Latian Islands. Um and uh then he got out and he wanted to go to Florida. His best friend from the Navy wanted to go to California, so they they flipped a coin and he ended up out in California and you know that you know and met my grandmother and then had their kids. And you know, my dad and ants were born out in California, and then I was born in you know California as well. Uh but my mom's dad uh flew in the Army Air Corps, so it was before the Air Force, it was the Army Air Corps, and he was a um was a was a pilot, he was a bomber. Uh he flew the B-52s, the B-17s, the B-22s, 21s, I believe. Um, and you know, he flew in World War II, Korean War, Vietnam, and retired from the Air Force. And uh, so I had that, you know, as a kid growing up, and you know, but I was just in awe of the military uh ever since I was a little kid. And you know, one of the things you're saying about the Marine Corps, the Marine Marines are badasses, they are the elite, the the most elite fighting force that the world has ever seen. And you know, so I was always you know drawn to become a Navy SEAL, but I I was also enamored by the Marine Corps and just the structure and the discipline. And let's be real, their uniforms, their dress uniforms are the absolute best in the world. Um, you know, nothing comes close to it. Um, but you know, as I was getting ready to graduate high school, I you know decided to go into the Navy to become a Navy SEAL. Um, but yeah, the the PR machine back in the day uh was was really good when it came to the Marine Corps. A lot of people knew about the Marine Corps, which is funny because typically the Marine Corps has always had the smallest budget for marketing, but somehow they just get the word out, and everybody knows what a Marine is. Once a Marine, always a Marine. And it's just there's a lot of tradition in the Marine Corps, but there's a lot of tradition in the Air Force, there's a lot of tradition in the Army, there's a lot of tradition in the Navy, you know, and then also, you know, the Coast Guard that we have in America is is absolutely incredible what they do. You know, a lot of service members, you know, there's you know, some banter back and forth between the different uh branches. And, you know, we always, you know, would give the Coast Guard a hard time for not being the actual military, but the Coast Guard does phenomenal things for our nation. And, you know, and now we have Space Force, which not everybody knows a lot about, but it's it's a newer thing, and it's it's really cool to see how the PR has gotten better for the military. And now you can, I mean, that's I would say there's good and bad to everything, there's good and bad to social media, and I will say, you know, the military using social media as a recruiting tool is absolutely um, I think it's paramount to reaching the next generation of warfighters.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

Absolutely. Um even from the US Marine perspective, the Royal Marines. I mean, I'd love to have joined the Royal Marines. I got friends in the Royal Marines. Um, but I think for me that sort of uh barrier of am I fit enough? Because I wasn't really fit, I played a sport, but more I was right there, I was a winger, so I I wasn't very good at long distance running, but short distance, fantastic, and long distance. But they marketing, you know, 99.9%, is it 99.9% need not apply? And you just got this guy as commando just you know in this swamp, you know, just up to his eyeballs in water. It looked incredible. And I thought, oh my god, life, how many people did that recruit as well? And again, they they're a really small force, um, but very elite from our side. And I remember doing uh Wimbledon. Um if you look at if you ever watch Wimbledon the tennis competition, you'll see service personnel thought it throughout the crowd, you know, then um and that was something we could do. And I was like, there used to be like half of the guys used to be Marines and uh they could party hard, you know, they worked hard, party hard. Honestly, they were a nightmare when we were staying in the same uh place as well. I could imagine, I remember those days. And um one of them actually a few years ago, I won't say what year, but walked onto centre court holding the trophy, and I'm sure he was half cut as well, holding the winner's trophy. Um but uh I used to listen to these guys and and and and how they talked about things, and you know, even when they said they've been on exercise with Navy SEALs, and my ears picked up instantly. I'm gonna go my god, you know, people tell tell me more. Um because I just you know, I I I like the training they went through. I thought for me it was quite uh felt like a challenge that not many people can do.

SPEAKER_01 9:01

It is, it is a challenge, and it's it's very difficult. You know, a lot of people say that uh, you know, the selection training to become a Navy SEAL uh is the hardest selection training in the world because of our high attrition rate. So if you look at it from a statistics standpoint of the amount of people that show up versus the amount of people that make it through, statistically we have the most dropouts, which means okay, cool. It could be considered the hardest military selection training in the world. But you know, I've worked with every branch of the military, I've worked with every special forces unit in in the different branches, and they all have very hard, difficult selection training, like very difficult, very specialized, you know, and I can just speak for what I know, you know, going through BUDS, which stands for basic underwater demolition seal training. Um, it was it was very difficult. You know, I started in class 242 and graduated with class 242. And I believe there was 222 guys on day one, and I believe I was one of 28 of the originals that started that training and finished with that same class. And you know, it's it's very hard training. And but the thing is, is it's completely optional at any point in time, Blayton. If you don't want to be in that training and you want to go back out to the regular fleet navy or go to the regular fleet navy if you've never been there to finish your career, whether that's four years or do 20 years in the in the Navy, uh doing an awesome job that's very much needed for our nation. All you have to do is ring the bell three times, and then the pain and suffering will stop. And they'll literally right then and there. It's not like, hey, I'm quit. And they're like, Cool, well, you got to finish this and then we'll pull you. It doesn't matter. At any point in time, you say, Hey, I'm done. They say, Are you sure? Yep, cool. Go ring that bell three times, and then you are instantly removed from whatever the class is doing. Now they might load you in a truck and then you're gone, or they might, you know, uh sit you down in a chair and put some blankets around you to get you warm and give you a cup of you know, coffee or hot chocolate, just to kind of mess with the other students that are there and they're cold and wet and miserable. And like you said, wet and sandy is a big thing, meaning, hey, go hit the surf, meaning go get in the ocean, come out, roll around in the sand to where you are covered head to toe like a sugar cookie. And then let's continue the physical beatdown and the the workout and the exercise while wet and sandy, which is, as you can imagine, not very comfortable. And so guys would be going through that training and they look over and see their teammate, a good person, a friend, right? Might be one of your best, best pals at the time. You look over and you see him not shivering, he's not cold, he's warm in a blanket drinking coffee, and you might be like, dang, that looks nice. And there that would get more people to quit because they're like, Man, I don't oh wow, I don't want to do this anymore. That looks nice. Like, I want to go over there and you know, um, you know, there's you know, there's games that the instructors will play. And, you know, when we came back from our deployment to Ramadi in 2006, that was my second combat deployment. I was over at BUDS as an instructor for a little bit of time before Jocko pulled me over to the training command to work for him, uh, doing the training for the actual SEALs preparing there for combat. But when I was a Buzz instructor, you know, you just play games with students. And I remember one of the things I would tell guys is, you know, I they're in the middle of a really hard evolution. And one of the things that I learned going through training and then put to use as an instructor is fatigue makes cowards of us all. And this is a saying fatigue makes cowards of us all. Because how often late in in life, when you are tired, exhausted, worn out, just mentally or physically broken down, have you made really good life decisions? Do you tend to make good decisions or bad decisions when you're tired and exhausted? Yeah, you tend to make bad decisions, but that's why one of the things that we teach at Echelon Front is detachment is a superpower. If you can learn to detach from your emotions and think logically, that's going to put you in a better situation as a human and especially as a leader. And so I would see these guys going through training and they're just, you could see it in their eyes. They're just smoked physically and mentally. And I would play little games with them and I would tell them, hey, you know you're going to quit. You know you don't really want to be here. You're just doing it just to say that you did it or you're trying not to let your team down. But I would I would mess with them and I would tell them, hey, if you quit now, which you know you're going to, but if you quit now before these other guys, you'll have a better pick at the next duty station because nothing is guaranteed. So if you quit now, you'll get the better pick. And guys would think about that. And I would just repeat that over and over and over, you know, and I would just tell guys, hey, you know you're gonna quit. You might as well do it now. Why do you want to endure that pain and that suffering when you don't have to? You're not gonna make it through. So why are you doing this? Go go do something else that you enjoy. And I would just put that on repeat, and I would watch some of these students that would recognize what I was doing and they would shut it out. And that's the type of guy we want in our community is the individual that can recognize the outside voice isn't helping them. You have to learn to shut it out. And then there's other guys that would start to listen to it and they'd kind of like acknowledge it and you know, start to kind of buy into it, and then they would quit. And it didn't mean that they're a bad person, it just meant that's not that's not the type of mentality that we want in the SEAL teams. We want the individual that can endure pain and suffering and shut the outside noise out so that they can continue on. And we we talk about that at Echelon Front, you know. So it's a leadership consulting company that Jocko Willink and Lake Babin started, um, or chief training officer there now. I've been a part of the executive leadership team for a while and started off as the first leadership instructor they brought on board. And, you know, now we, you know, we have our hands-on scenario-based leadership training that I helped build, that now Cody Gandhi is in charge of, former Marine, absolute badass, you know, very smart, very intelligent guy that is a phenomenal instructor, and he's taken the training and and brought it to the next level. Uh, but that's one of the things that we talk about going through training is as leaders, we need to learn to shut the outside voices off and focus on the mission at hand. And that was one of the key things that would help guys get through our hard training. The the training is going to be very difficult, but as I'm sure you've experienced, life is difficult, business is difficult. You know, I'm married with kids, marriage is difficult, having kids is difficult, navigating relationships with business partners and and peers and a team and leadership, that's difficult. But at the end of the day, we have to learn to filter through all the noise and ask ourselves, hey, what's my mission at hand? What am I trying to accomplish? And stay focused on that mission. And that's what I learned going through BUDs and then maintained that throughout my time in the SEAL teams. And it was reiterated to me my whole career in the SEAL teams by peers and by leaders and even subordinates of, hey, we got to stay focused on the mission at hand. What's the most important thing we're trying to accomplish? Put in the work and get the job done.

SPEAKER_00 17:04

Yeah, my God, yes. That's such a great way of looking at it. And I suppose a question I pulled from all of that as well is when you've got that guy in the blankets drinking the hot chocolate, he's obviously there as a look at this distraction. And did you find that the the obviously as when you were in distractors especially and you're seeing the guys, the recruits going through the train, going through that exercise, and you've got this one guy or two or three guys sitting there warmed up and they caught eye contact, you saw them looking. Were they the ones that you saw typically drop out immediately, or are they the ones who use that to drive forward and continue and think I'm not gonna end up like these guys? I suppose that's quite a hard question to sort of pull apart there.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

No, no, no, it's a good question, and I understand it because I lived it and I also saw it as an instructor. Um, I would, when I was going through training, and I've, you know, I've heard Leif say this, and Jocko and other guys from Buds that that made it through, is I would see guys that would quit, and I I never thought anything less of them. I didn't think they were a bad person or a bad teammate. I would just look at them and say, I'm gonna keep going. Because I would, I would take from, I would take for me, uh, extra motivation and discipline. And as you know, discipline is the key to all things in life. Motivation fails. So I would use what they chose to do as motivation for me to be more disciplined to keep pushing forward. I would I would look at them and say, I don't want to make that mistake. Because 99% of the time, the guys that would quit, they regretted it instantly. It was like this instant, oh shoot, what did I do? Because they made an emotional decision. And so I would look at that and I would use it as fuel to keep pushing forward to endure the pain and the suffering a little bit longer because I knew the evolution has to end. And so I would just take it as one evolution as a time. Hey, we're on this run, it's miserable. Okay, cool. When we get done with the run, we'll switch to something else. We're doing log PT, boat PT. All right, cool. This sucks. I'm tired, I'm exhausted. This evolution will end. And I would just shift my focus from one evolution to the next, not thinking about the end of the day or the end of the week. What is my mission at hand? What am I what am I trying to accomplish right now? And that's what I would go focus on. And you know, you would see a lot of guys look at the guys that would quit and use it as motivation to stay in the fight, to keep pushing forward. And then there was also a large percentage of guys, and this is why I I would say it was a mix of there's a you know, about 20% would look at it as motivation and keep moving. Another 80% would be like, dang, that guy was a stud. If he quit, I don't know if I can make it. Like, why I would literally hear guys when somebody else would quit, they'd be like, Well, man, if if so and so just quit, I don't know if I'm gonna make it through. And they would allow somebody else's decision to add a little more doubt into their confidence and their ability, and then boom, they would be swayed that way. You know, uh later today, Sean Glass and I, he's another instructor at Echelon Front. We're doing a training on our Extreme Ownership Academy. It's our live leadership training that we provide at Echelon Front about how calm is contagious, but also chaos is contagious. Our attitudes are contagious as humans. And so, as leaders, we have to be intentional with learning how to detach from our emotions, stay focused on the mission and the task at hand, and not allow our emotions to take control so that we can remain calm to better lead ourselves and lead the people around us. And so, all it was, if I was to think about it to one thing, is the inability to control your emotions. That's what would drive people to quit training.

SPEAKER_00 21:37

I couldn't agree more. I mean, yes. Um gosh, there's so much to pull from that as well. It is though. I mean, you know, I don't know if um, you know, how much Ben told you about myself, but I was in the RAF Royal Air Force. Um I'm still serving as a reservist um for the moment. And uh I remember when I turned up at basic training. gosh, I'm trying to count the years now in my own head. Twenty two twenty-four years ago, you're giving this pamphlet about what to expect and what to do. And I felt really bad looking back now. I feel really bad about this. But the on the pamphlet, there was a there was a chap, a young chap and a girl carrying, you know, the the the black holders, no, I think it was black holders, then it was another bad type of bag used to have when it got issued. You know, and I I looked at that picture and and the and the and the young man in there was a little bit out of shape. And I remember just thinking if he can do it, I can it sounds really bad. But I remember thinking to myself if he can do it, I can do it.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

There's nothing wrong with that. I I don't think there's anything wrong with that Layton because I would look at guys going through training and think the same thing. But I never I never allowed the the negative side of that of like man this guy is so much bigger and stronger and faster than me. I don't know if I could do this. I I would look at everybody and use it as uh you know fuel motivation discipline whatever you want to fill into there for me to be able to do it. And I remember one of my buddies Ray Mendoza we were went through buzz together uh he actually uh wrote and produced the movie Warfare have you watched that I have wow unreal yes unreal movie and so Ray had actually been in um in buds uh both once before made it very close to um graduation and um got dropped from training and you know went out to the regular fleet navy came back and was in my buds class and I remember him saying this to me going through training he said JP none of these instructors are better than us they just went through it at an at an earlier time if they can go through it and make it into the SEAL teams so can we now I'm 18 19 years old going through training you know Ray at you know at the time I was like good lord this guy is super old you know he was like 27 or 28 uh but I remember how much older he was than me but I remember thinking about what Ray said and I took that as a positive you know way to look at it like hey it they're no better than me they breathe the same oxygen we breathe they they are humans just like I am and if they can make it through this training so can I but I've also looked at people who when you look at them now as we know you you can't always judge a book by its cover because I do jujitsu and I've been training jujitsu for a very long time and you know there are people I train jujitsu with that if you were to look at them just off their looks you know their height their weight you know their body type you'd be like I I could whoop them no they would whoop you right they would whoop me but I've looked at people that you know physically didn't hold themselves to a high standard that were doing things and I absolutely thought the same thing you thought I'm like man if he could do that 100% I can um and so I think there's there just needs to be a healthy balance there like anything in life yeah absolutely I mean I I've you know I've got friends who are in the paratroopers uh the British paratroopers the Royal Marines and you know even spoken or hear you know people from the SAS and SBS talk as well on on various podcasts um and talk and written in various books over the years and it was actually the big muscular guys who everyone was probably in awe of oh yeah failed I don't know if it's the same in the SEALs but similar when I was picking up um it was it you know military police week you know I was military police and in the air force and we were you know aircraft security and we went across to Belize to pick up um I think we dropped off a bunch of guys and we were picking up a bunch of paratroopers to send home to bring home and I remember looking at these kids I saw one muscular guy one like you know bodybuilder type shape yeah most of them certainly the the uh the private skinny skinny guys and watching them lift their burgens into the aircraft which my god alive so I joined the air force um was insane it was wow I've read about it you know and even speaking to friends you know down the line over the years as I've got to know these guys as well always the skinny guys never the big and because it's and they realize that as well is well yeah he's look at all the weight he's carrying yeah and he's all he's all yeah that that extra muscle mass requires a lot of oxygen and you're carrying that weight you know I I went through buds I was 140 145 pounds when I checked when I got through SQT I was trying to lift and get bigger I checked in my first platoon I was 155 pounds and I was like okay well I do need to be a little bit bigger to be a little more capable but there's there's a healthy there's a healthy balance it's are you capable? That's what you have to like analyze and you know I saw guys that were big strong like bodybuilder types that show up to buds that I looked at and I was like dang that's a big strong dude and they were some of the first ones to quit and then there is other guys that I went that I was in buds with that were you know medium height chubby and they made it their buds you know I was shorter skinny and I made it their buds I also saw some guys that were big and strong that made it through buds so it just depends on what if your body is capable of enduring all that training and that was a big thing in the SEAL teams is hey we are war fighters we're not bodybuilders are you able to do your job are you able to throw on gear and go hump through the mountains of Afghanistan or patrol through the streets of Ramadi when it's 120 plus degrees while you have a full loadout water extra gear extra ammo extra batteries can you do that and maintain a high level of proficiency in your job and if you can cool it doesn't matter if you're 150 pounds or 215 pounds it's all relative to you being able to to do your job um you know and that was a cool thing that I saw from the military is you know you'd you'd have you'd have guys from all different walks of life that made it through that training that were really good at their job. And that's what's cool about the military.

SPEAKER_00 28:49

I was just gonna say that's what's the brilliance of the military of the military is you've got all this different walks of life coming together for one cause or one for one yeah for one cause you know and and you know even from my what we call a tray train in in the Air Force um I think we changed it to something else now because it's you know I think I call it professions but something we call a trade train and my from as a military policeman we're still in touch. And I think it's because and and I saw somebody who was in the course behind me a few months ago and he was just shocked that we still had little reunions. I think two or three of them still served in the rest are out um but I think it's because we went through something together. I don't know why it was not nothing different from the course in front of us or the course behind us you know but we just I don't know we we just we were brotherhood slash sisterhood as well you could say because it was you know and it was just something different and we're all from different walks of life. We couldn't be any more different. I think I was the only Welshman there um we had uh a Northern Irish chap who sounded very English but called himself Northern Irish uh we had a Scottish chap you know but we were all from all over the UK I was the old man because I I left you know I did four years as a communicator left rejoined as military police um and I'd never felt a sense of belonging like it before and I wouldn't say it was an arduous course um and you just you know um academically it was for me because I'm not very academic well I wasn't but it's just we just felt like we went through a journey together and we were all very supportive of each other as well. And and one of the chaps you know uh went on to do extra he's going on to do extraordinary things in the military you know as soon as a military policeman he wanted to leave and join the infantry uh regiment of the Royal Air Force RF regiment and I remember one of the instructors again this is where you know I touched upon instructor as well I want to sort of touch upon is one of the instructors um said why I says well they go out to the front they do frontline stuff and he's the instructor was like well actually believe it or not we're doing that now you know Afghanistan was picking up a lot more we're doing a lot more front stuff and you'll probably see a lot more of the front line than this regiment will um and he has you know he's done close protection he's done close support with the infantry with the army he's done BRF which uh brigade uh BR BRF um they sort of operated out of Camp Bastion flew out um operated a level below special forces um you know he was he did he's done that um great guy and he was a guy who wasn't the fittest guy in on the course but he wanted to do something he had this drive goes well I want to go and do this close support uh deployment with the army and he got fit and I think you know and I don't think he's regretted his decision you know he's still in he's still serving he's making a career out of it and he's I think he's gonna retire next year from the military. Um but that's it and I think once you know you and I think that's the great thing about the military is you could be anyone and you can achieve absolutely anything you want if you put your mind to it as well. So going on to your instructor obviously on your documentary The Elite Sniper man I could probably talk about this being a sniper there's so much to talk about your career.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Yeah why actually talk about this sniper first because I think it can lead into what I saw you instruct in the chat on the video which I thought was phenomenal by the way um but what led you to being becoming a sniper in the Navy SEALs um you know so when I was a kid playing Navy SEALs um I didn't know a lot about snipers but I knew like what a sniper was and in the base of it and I was just always drawn to um just the the aspect of you know slowly sneaking up onto people getting into a position uh being able to just sit and wait and and wait for that perfect opportunity which is really funny because that's counterintuitive to who I was as a kid and as an adult because I like to go go go I just like boom boom boom very default aggressive which helps when you're a machine gunner because I was also a machine gunner in the SEAL teams uh but there was this draw to me about just being able to slowly get yourself into a position and be able to observe andor take a shot if you needed undetected and it I I think it was just the challenge of that and the way my brain worked even as a kid I didn't know that I was building you know sniper hides as a kid um you know I would do it in my grandparents' barn I would do it in my in my garage where I was you know in the garage and I would crack the garage door enough to where I could see out from the garage out into the street uh our driveway what went up to our house so it was elevated so it gave me that perspective of being able to look up and down the street I would you know set my my pellet gun up in there and it was pitch black and I'd get everything set up and then I would go outside and I would look to see if I could see my setup. Nobody taught me to do that. For me it just made sense of hey you don't want to be right there at the edge of the of the uh the garage because you're gonna be seen get back into the shadows and if I can be in the shadows and I can see but they can't see me then I'm in a good position. I am in a position that gives me an advantage where I can see them they can't see me. And so I was doing these things as a kid and not knowing that I was building urban sniper hides in my garage in my parents' barn in in in different places. And then I would do it out on my grandparents' property as well. And um I was stalking where I I would have my my parents drop me off at the edge of my grandparents' property and they would go up to the house of the family and I would get out and I'd have my my bat my bag of gear that I had gotten from different garage sales from Vietnam vets and the Army Navy surplus store and I would get into my camis and I'd make my own little ghillie suit uh and then I would tell my parents like hey try to see if you can find me like sneaking up and I'm willing to bet they probably never were really watching for me but I didn't know that. And I would spend hours trying to sneak from the edge of my grandparents' property on the road all the way up into the house. And it was just something I loved to do I just loved doing that whether it was freezing cold or blazing hot during the summer it didn't matter. I just really enjoyed that um that exercise that evolution that I was doing so then I go into the SEAL teams and you start learning about snipers while you're going through training because you have different instructors that are snipers and you know a lot of different jobs in the SEAL teams and so I was I would hear about them they would say different stories and share the stories in training and I just remember saying man I really want to be a sniper I want to be a sniper and then go through SEAL qualification training which is the advanced training after buds before you make it into the SEAL teams and um you know going through that and learning different aspects of the sniper capabilities and what's required checking to SEAL team three do my workup deployment and during my workup one uh there was a few of the older guys that were snipers. You know you had Chris Kyle who was in Charlie platoon so he was in my sister platoon and then I had you know and then another guy over there who's a really good sniper Doug Wallace and then in Delta platoon I had you know Benny and uh Ricky uh they were both snipers and they helped teach me different things about being snipers um going through training and then you know we do our first deployment you come back and they have this you know opportunity for guys to go to sniper school and I remember like getting ready to raise my hand of like hey I want to go and they're like Donnell you're going and I'm like yes like it's it's what I wanted and I think you know Benny and Ricky probably had some imp input or some say on me going because you know they were both good snipers and they'd been teaching me things about you know being a sniper and then Doug Wallace who was over in Charlie platoon came over to Delta Platoon to be our leading petty officer and he was a good sniper. And so now I had these other guys that were snipers that I looked up to who really helped me as as a young man in the SEAL teams and were teaching me these things. And so I go through sniper school and man I absolutely loved it like I loved everything about being a sniper learning how to stalk and learning how to set up for shots and to take shots and just you know learning about the different weapon platforms and the capabilities and you know a lot of hard training a lot of really hard training and the instructors that put us through the training they're all snipers they all were very capable um but it was it was really cool uh having these guys in my life that poured into me and that's one of the things that I loved about the SEAL teams is you know pouring in to your people to make them better than you are because that's the legacy play is to leave it better than you found it which means your people and you know that's just such a um a principle that I think a lot of leaders fail to recognize is you need to pour into your people to make them better than you. You know I have like I said I'm I'm married my wife and I we have four kids and I want my kids to be happy and successful and I want them to be more successful than I am in in life. And that's not like a financial thing. Now I do want them to be more financially successful than than my wife and I. But when it comes to being happy and being healthy and having a you know a good marriage and a good relationship with their spouse and their kids like that's success is you know waking up and being happy for the situation that you're in. That to me that's success because I've worked with people that are just filthy rich like just people that have F you money and they're miserable. They are absolutely miserable. And then I've worked with people that are filthy rich and they're happy because they've built this life but money doesn't mean happiness money doesn't mean success because I've also worked with people and known people in my life that didn't have a lot of money. They weren't you know wealthy but they were happy because they had a good marriage and they had a good family and and they loved the Lord and you know they were strong in their faith as Christians and you know they were you know doing good things and helping other people and cool and I've also known people that didn't have money and didn't have all these things and were miserable. So for me I think success is a mindset of you understanding hey this is where I'm at in life it could be way worse but I'm happy for what I have and that was a mindset that I had going through BUDS SQT and the SEAL teams of man I'm so thankful that God gave me this opportunity. And when I was going through sniper school I was thankful for the opportunity and the other thing Leighton is I wanted to make my guys proud I wanted my leadership to be proud of me. I want and that drove me to work hard like I wanted them to be proud of my capabilities and and I wanted them to look at me and say damn I'm glad he's on our team I'm glad he's in my platoon and that was just one of the things that just was always in my mind of are you doing are you doing everything you could do? Are you showing up a hundred percent are you putting in a hundred percent effort are you leaving everything on the table at the end of the day like when I go to bed can I look at myself and say I did everything you know there's a sign in the SEAL teams that was above most of the doors and it said the enemy thanks you for not giving 100% today and that's something I've always thought of and I have it saved on my phone as a photo and when I am working with different clients uh teaching leadership and that's what we do at Echelon Front we teach leadership I always share that slide as a reminder of that's the mindset you have to have. And for business I just switch it up I'll show that picture and then the next slide is your competition thanks you for not giving 100% today. Yeah and it's just it's a very simple very simple mindset um but to circle back to what you were talking about sniper school for me it was being thankful for the opportunity and wanting to be the best so that I could do my job and take care of my teammates that's all I've ever cared about is am I gonna do am I going to do a good job am I gonna show up and perform at my highest level not Leighton's highest level not Jocko not Laf not Chris Kyle not Benny not Ricky not you know am I showing up as the best version of JP yeah because that's what I need to focus on because I can't be you I can't be jocko I can't be layfantle I can't be Benny can't be Ricky I can't be Doug I I can't be those guys nor do I want to be those guys I want to be who God designed me to be but I want to be the best version. And that was something that would really drive me to perform in training which allowed us to perform at a high level in combat because discipline equals freedom as I know you're very familiar with that's one of Jocko's big things but the the discipline that we had in training gave us freedom at a very high level on the battlefield.

SPEAKER_00 43:44

Yeah no yeah I mean there's a lot to take from that and but it's all good stuff it's all people used to say you know you you can't perform to say Jocko's high level you can't uh lay for Chris Kyle because you're right they're different and they they Their own high standards is going to be very different to your high standards.

SPEAKER_01 44:04

And you could be doing the impossible or trying to do the impossible, which then will have a detrimental effect on yourself, which then but also recognizing they can't do some of the things I can do. Exactly. Like Jocko, phenomenal combat leader, was incredible in the sealed teams as a machine gunner and as a comms guy. And, you know, was really good at these things that he did. But Jocko could never do what I did as a sniper. And he knows that. We've talked about it. He goes, dude, there's no way I could do what you did as a sniper. And I know there's no way I could do what he did as a comms guy and as an operator and as an officer. He is built different. Leif Babin is built different. He is a phenomenal combat leader. And Leif knows that as a gunfighter, like and as a sniper, let me just speak for that. But as a sniper, Leif has said, I could never do what you did. And I know I could never do what Leif did. And right now at Echelon Front, Jocko's the CEO. Leif Bab is the president. They are phenomenal leaders, phenomenal just teachers and just individuals that develop their people. And that is something I'm trying to get better at is thinking strategically, which they're both really good at. Is okay, cool. As a leader, how do I have to how do I have to shift my mindset to be a better leader? How can I think more strategically? How can I empower my people to elevate their game and be better at what at what they do? And so it's just understanding like, hey, I have my skill sets. There's things I'm really good at, there's things they're really good at. And that's a beautiful thing about the SEAL teams is we make up a team. You know, it's understanding our strengths and our weaknesses, how we work together. And you know, the the most important part of our success in the SEAL teams was our ability to build relationships with each other, with the people that worked with us. You know, that's why one of the things that we teach at Echelon Front is our laws of combat. And the very first law of combat that we teach is cover and move. And when you look at cover and move, while it's a gunfighting tactic that I know you're well aware of, like I lay down cover fire, you move to a position, you start shooting, then I can move and we can shoot and move and communicate. That's great for the military, it's great for law enforcement. But how does that apply in business? Well, it's you and I working together for a common goal. It's you and I breaking down silos and barriers between our different departments, or even just as individuals, and saying, all right, cool. This is what we need to do to work together. That's the mission that we're trying to accomplish. Cool. Hey, you know what? I'm gonna do this to help you so that you can move forward. Your team is gonna be in a good position, then your team can help us move forward. It's about a commonality. What are we trying to what are we trying to accomplish? And if we don't have good relationships, we're not gonna be able to do that. And if you look at it from a leadership aspect, relationships is how we lead. Because if you and I have a really good relationship, Leighton, we're we're gonna have influence over each other. That's what leadership is. It's not a title, it's not a position, it's not rank, it's influence. And the only way you can influence people to do things is have a really good, strong working relationship with them.

SPEAKER_00 47:40

Yes. Um, I mean, I thought about this when you're talking way back, but going back to what you're just saying then about um working as a team, and I don't know if you've heard it over in the US, there's two parts to this. I want to say the second part, so it's quite rude. But the first part is no I in team, you know, and how it's spelled, but there's a you in to you next Tuesday because I don't want to say the the the word, but uh because YouTube will probably cut it and yeah, all that but uh it's so true that because if you're a you you are gonna have a detrimental effect on that team. You know, if it's not and if you are there's like I said, there's no I in team because it's a team effort. And but if you are behaving as an I, you become a you, which means you are gonna affect it. And also leadership, you know, Richard uh Richard Branson maybe years and years ago, he had a saying where um train your guys to leave, uh treat them because as if you want them to stay. And I think again, you what you said earlier about leadership, I've worked with some terrible leadership in the military. And I've worked with some excellent ones as well. And you know, one guy, you know, Hamish, uh, you know, I doubt he listens to it so I might have to send it to him now. Um he was probably my favourite sergeant because if if I messed up, I knew I wasn't gonna get a ball again. He was gonna speak to me and uh he was gonna be speak to me on a level because he knew me from my previous unit when I was a junior, when I um when I first passed out of training, he was my my one of my corporals. Um and then we ended up back together, he was my sergeant at another basis, and my biggest worry was letting him down because I had so much respect for him. And it's because of that relationship, you know. And uh if I said one of my inappropriate jokes, he he'd he'd tell me off, or he'd smile. But letting him down when he was my sergeant was one of my biggest fears. Um, and when I put in the papers to leave the military, uh, I wouldn't say his name or his rank, but he treated me abysmally, you know. Um I had the same thing happen to me. Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01 49:41

In the SEALs? Oh, yeah. We have good and bad leaders in the SEAL teams. I had some leaders like you were just describing that were phenomenal. That like my old Master Chief Rob Harless. He was when I told him, Hey, I'm getting out, he was pretty sad. He's like, Man, that's a that's a sad day in the teams. Are you sure this is what you want to do? I said, Master chief, it's not what I want to do, it's what I need to do for my family. And this is what I need to do. And he said, I understand that, JP. Whatever you need from me, I will support you. And he gave me phenomenal top cover and support. And then I had other guys that were like, All right, cool, F and quitter. And that's how they treated me as a quitter, even though I had three combat deployments and I had done some good stuff overseas and some good stuff in training, because I wasn't doing my 20 years, they looked at me as a quitter, which trust me, I looked at myself the same way plenty of times. So it's like, cool, you're not telling me anything I haven't told myself. Um, but you know, for me, there was a moment of when I recognized I had made the right decision because naturally, even especially in the SEAL teams, you really think, man, if I get out, I'm letting my guys down. There's a little bit of truth there. But the reality, I'm sorry, the reality of it is the SEAL teams is gonna keep moving on. Yeah, the SEAL teams will be filled within a month. Yeah, yeah. My spot was filled right away. When it was, hey, you're absolutely getting out, cool. We need another instructor to come replace JP. And it was like an instant cool, he's getting out, boom, somebody could come in and replace them. I was training them, I was, you know, and then it was like, cool, I'm transitioning out. And for me, when I had like this moment where I was like, Oh, I'm just another person, which is fine. Like, I didn't take it personal. It's when they were getting our office that I worked at at the training command was getting new gear. They're and they're getting new gear as instructors, and they're getting these new watches, they're these awesome Sunto watches, and like the guys were getting all their gears and all the watches and other stuff. And I just made a comment. I'm like, Oh, cool, you getting watches? Like, am I getting one? And the guy looks at me, he goes, Why? You're getting out. Oh, and I wasn't getting out next week, I was still gonna be there for another six to seven months. But he said, Why you're getting out? And I was like, check, Roger, you know what I mean? And I was just like, You're right, I am getting out, so I had to change my heart posture because initially I was just like, you know what, screw you, bro. Like, but then I caught myself because that attitude that I had towards him wasn't right. Did I need that watch? No, because I was getting out, yeah, and for me, it was just it I had to shift my heart posture and change my thinking, but it just it was like this first little indicator to me that solidified, okay, cool, I'm getting out. This is a decision I made, it's the right decision, I'm doing it for my family. I love the SEAL teams, I'm gonna miss the SEAL teams, but the SEAL teams don't need me. They don't need me. And you know, it's the same thing in business. Any company that's out there, everybody is replaceable. And for me, as I transitioned out, and now what I do at Echelon Front, I know I'm replaceable. Echelon Front doesn't need me to do what they do. Do I play uh an important role? I think so. Am I good at what I do? I try to be good and I try to be a good instructor and I try to be a good leader. But I also know that if I make some mistake or if I decide to leave, Echelon Front's gonna be okay. If I was to get fired, or if I was to leave, Echelon Front's gonna be okay. So, what do I need to do? I need to work on being a better version of who I am every day to contribute to our team's success. And I need to earn my seat at the table every day because I have a seat at the table, but that seat's not guaranteed every day. I have to show up, I have to put in the work, I have to be humble, I have to be coachable, I have to be teachable, I have to work hard, and I have to go and do the work that's required every single day. And I think a lot of people get comfortable in life and assume that they are entitled things. That's a that's a bad thing in the veteran community. They assume that because they served in the military, that they are entitled to things when they get out. Nobody owes you anything in life. I don't care who you are, what you've done, nobody owes you anything. You have to earn these opportunities every day. You have to earn them and you have to work to maintain them.

SPEAKER_00 55:05

No, absolutely. I mean, really leads into my next question is how did you end up at Eklon Front with Jocko? How were you? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:14

So I got out uh quick version, and you know, if we want to do another episode of this in the future, I'd be honored to do it. Yeah, um, you know, uh I'm very thankful that Ben Duff connected us. He's a great human. He is, and obviously, all the work that Marlesa did to facilitate this with us. I'm very happy for this as well. Uh, she's an amazing asset to our team at Echelon Front. Um, but so I got out of the military, I had an opportunity to do sales at a financial company, um, completely unknown world to me, but again, humble, coachable, teachable, willing to work hard, cool. I can do it, I can learn it, put in the work. You know, and I got that job, and I remember leaving the interview, and they said, All right, cool. Hey, when can you start? And um, you know, I was still in the military transitioning out, so I was like, well, let me figure out when I can actually do this and work through all those things. And um, you know, I called Jocko and I told him I got this job. He said, Awesome, just do what you did working for me and you'll be okay. So Jocko was telling me what to do without telling me specifically what to do. And, you know, that's what I've learned good leaders do is they teach their people how to think, not what to think. Good leaders ask their people questions to get them to think so that they can come up with ideas on their own, so they can have ownership and they can execute their own plan. So that's what I did.

SPEAKER_02 56:43

What do you do? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:45

And so that's what I did, and worked for that company for a while, learned a lot about business, had some uh pretty cool opportunities uh there, did some really fun stuff, learned a lot. Um, you know, left that company to start my own thing for a little bit, wanted to do some team building events. I wanted to, you know, I was really drawn to teach shooting for law enforcement, shooting tactics, combatives, uh, because there's a big void there. There's you know a definite need for that in that space. I was doing little odd-in jobs whenever I was actually an extra in Transformers Five. So I spent a little time over in the UK doing some filming. No way. Um, yeah, I played a navy, I played a Navy SEAL in Transformers 5, um, you know, which was cool because Michael Bay likes to use Navy SEALs to play Navy SEALs, uh, to add realism to what we did. Uh, was able to do a little bit of uh, you know, tactical advising for the stunt team um that was there. Those guys are phenomenal what they do. Stunt stunt stunt men and women are crazy, they're absolutely crazy for what they do.

SPEAKER_00 57:50

My friend, my friend is when he worked on Banda Brothers in the Pacific. He's nuts. He's brilliant, though.

SPEAKER_01 57:55

Yeah, the unreal. They don't get the credit they deserve. Uh, so I was doing all those things, and then um, you know, was really struggling to find something consistent and fulfilling, and had the opportunity uh to come see what Jocko and Leif were doing. I was reaching out to Jocko and consistently just asking him, hey, if there's anything I can do to help you, let me know, sir. Um and he uh he reached out to me and he said, Hey, we'd love for you to come to San Diego and check out this uh event that Laif and I are doing, first time ever doing something like this. It's called the Muster. It's a two-day leadership event for individuals and small teams and large teams uh from all over the United States and the world to come check out. And I said, Cool, awesome. Um, and he goes, and then we can sit and talk about you know what it would look like for you to come on board echelon front as an instructor, because we're getting to the point where we're gonna need to bring on another instructor. Uh, we're starting to turn down gigs because of demand, because they wrote the book Extreme Ownership uh about a year prior. And it was a New York Times number one bestseller, top of the charts for a very long time. Yep, yeah, that phenomenal book. And I had read the book, I had implemented those things into my personal life. It helped me restore my marriage because my wife and I had been divorced, and then we we were trying to work things out again. I used the principles of extreme ownership and us being back involved in church again. And so those two things brought our marriage back. We got remarried, I got my family back together. I had applied those things in business, I knew they worked, I applied those things obviously in the skill teams, but they worked, and I just wanted to be a part of what Jocko and Leif were building. So I made my way out to San Diego and um, you know, just seeing what they had built and saw that and seeing the impact that they were creating in people's lives, I just wanted to be a part of it. And I and I told them, I'm like, hey, I'm all in. Whatever I can do to help you guys, let me know. And then Jocko had me on his podcast that weekend. It was episode 46, right at the back in the day at the beginning. And I shared some of my story then. And then uh Leif and Jocko brought me on board as the first leadership instructor and started doing keynotes and half day workshops. And then as we built and evolved the company, you know, Dave Burke came on board and a bunch of other instructors over the years, and they gave me the opportunity to build out our field training exercise program. So all of our hands-on scenario-based leadership training, and that was really cool, very fulfilling. Built a team there, and like I said, Cody Gandhi, uh, he started off just part-time as a role player, and he just came on board and just started implementing these things into his life. He is very smart. I'm sorry, he is very smart. He was able to not only understand what we did, but also teach and implement, which is critical. Um, you know, one of the things I say is knowledge is not power. You know, you've heard that saying, knowledge is power. No, it's a lot. Because you can have all the knowledge in the world, but if you do nothing to apply it to your life, what good is it? And so it's the application of knowledge that allows us to do powerful things. And so I'm seeing Cody just do these phenomenal things. We bring him on board full time. He becomes a junior instructor in training, and he took over the program as the director so that I was able to elevate up as he elevated. And it's been awesome. It's been nine and actually, yeah, nine and a half years. October will be 10 years from when I came on board Echelon Front as a first leadership instructor. And it's just amazing what we get to do at Echelon Front, teaching the lessons that we learned in combat to other individuals and companies so that they can apply those same lessons that we learned in combat and also learned and developed teaching and preparing guys for combat and being able to take those and apply them to people's personal and professional lives.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:12

Amazing. Quick one got two things. So the the shoot off with your um master. Is that at the little bighorn battle site? Is that one of the things you do?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:23

So that is our battlefield review. So at Echelon Front, we do the muster. It's a two-day leadership event. We have one coming up in two and a half weeks in San Diego. Uh, that'll be the 25th muster that we've done. Um, and so that's a two-day leadership event with Jocko Leif and all the instructors at Echelon Front. Then we also do the battlefield reviews. So those are at different historic uh battlefields in the United States with Jocko Leif and a handful of instructors uh walking through the battlefield and talking about the battle and taking what happened and taking those lessons and applying them uh to people's personal lives and business. And then we also have an event called the Council. It's a big, uh, bigger event with I say bigger, not bigger in people, but it's a um it's it's a different event where it's more of a it's a smaller event with people, um, where it's just more of an intimate setting where you're you know working through actual leadership problems real time with Jocko Leif, other instructors, and different business leaders. That's usually for higher-end business leaders that come to that event. And then we had the field training exercises where it's our hands-on scenario-based leadership training that we run people through different types of missions and scenarios using our laser tag systems. So we put people into um uh different squads to form up a platoon or a task unit, depending on how many people we have. And then you get to go out and run missions against my role players. And we use former and current SEALs, Green Brays, Rangers, Marshocks, SWAT operators as your opposition force that you're going up against to conduct Capture Co missions or different types of missions, and then afterwards we sit down and we debrief hey, what would you learn and take away from that mission? And how does that takeaway apply to business? And so we spend more time sitting down, debriefing the missions than we do the than spending time at on the actual run.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:30

And so, yeah, it's pretty cool. It's quite phenomenal. Um, the little bighorn one, my friend JD Hewitt has been to one of those.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:38

He's like, Yeah, he's a super fun.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:39

He's great, isn't he? Yeah, um, he's been on a couple of my battlefield tours around Europe. We've been to Normandy and Austria for the um oh, he's a wonderful guy, he's brilliant. Um, and he's the one who got me on to jockofu the pre-workout as well. I think it's the best pre-workout in the world that I've ever had. Nothing comes close to him. Um, get this nice little buzz from it as well. Um it's it's very different. So we did a battlefield tour around the 101st Airborne Division a few weeks ago. I put an order, I put an order in. We just went to all the places, not necessarily a battlefield tour, but it was more of a build-up to D-Day, going to all, you know, where Easy Company were and some of the other, you know, 101st regiments were, and then the airfields, the the you know, the spot where Eisenhower met the paratroopers, you know, that famous photo. Wow. We went there, um, and then we finished off at Membury Airfield, um, where Easy Company flew for market garden. But um, yeah, I got two people bring over a couple of tubs of uh joco fuel. Um, and I'm going to New Orleans next month for a Band of Brothers Symposium. I'm hoping to pick a couple of more up because I hear they sell them in Walmart. So I'm gonna go and sell them in Walmart and Vitamin Shop. So I'm gonna go and hunt one down and bring some more because I mean, you know, supply because it's really expensive to ship over. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:48

The other thing you could do is you could if you if you're gonna be there for a couple days, get on, you know, you can hit me up, I can help facilitate this, but you could order it from Jocko Fuel's website to Delivered to your hotel. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:03

Yeah. That'd be brilliant. Yeah. Yeah. I'll do that. Yeah. Um, before we go, because I um because I you gotta get you going. Your grandfather flew B-17s in World War II. Do you know what bomb group he flew with? Oh curiosity. I'll hopefully can if possible, I can try and do something for you if it's in England.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:21

Yeah, I will I will get that information from my aunt and uncle who know all of those things. I'm embarrassed to say I don't off the top of my head know that. Um, but you know, uh I'm sure you've watched the series Masters of the Air or Masters in the Air. Um and it's pretty crazy to know that he was a part of those those missions. Oh so was he in the hundredth bomb group? Oh, curiosity. I I I don't know. I will get that information. I should know that information. I should have done that research before this podcast. No, no, no, no, it's okay. Um, but I will reach out to my aunt and uncle and get that information for you.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:00

Yeah, I mean, what I can do, and you know, because I go down that end of the world, you know, the country of worlds, um, every now and again. Um, and I could go and visit that, you know, those airfields for you, or airfields, sorry, and I could feed it back to you to say this is where you flew from. I could probably try and do a little bit, I could probably do a little bit more digging and try try man and find barracks or something, you know, where the bomb group bomb squadron was there. So I can try and do that, you know. So I'll put that out there right now for you as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:25

Yeah, that would be amazing. And what I'd like to do is also connect you with my uncle Eric, who did, I think, you know, over 20, if not 30 years in the Air Force as a pilot. And he uh, you know, he married my aunt, uh, Aunt CJ, who is my aunt, um, who her her father is my grandfather that we're talking about. And they have all of his all of his letters that he wrote home from his deployments.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:53

Wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:54

Yeah. Wow. Pretty pretty amazing.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:58

Uh, it's pretty amazing. Yeah, I'd love to do that for you, mate. Um, it'd be an honor because I love, you know, I love walking down these old airfields where Kurtis Limay was, or like I said, is master of the 100th bomb group. And yeah, I love walking those airfields. I like getting the drone up and and seeing that would be amazing.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:14

I would love one day to be able to take a trip over there and and go do that with you. Um, you know, my sister's in the Air Force, she's a captain in the Air Force, she's a surgeon. And when she was going through some training uh last summer, uh, it was really cool. Um, you know, she sent back pictures and everything of different units that our grandfather was attached to or had worked with or was a part of. Um, and you know, you know, the the book The Bomber Mafia, uh, which is a phenomenal book, but just to realize that my grandfather was a part of a lot of those stories was just unreal to think about. But yes, I'll connect you with my uncle. Uh, he would probably be a phenomenal guest for this podcast as well. Um I'd love to, yeah, I'd love to because he's also a history buff like you. Um, and um yeah, like I said, he has all those letters, so that'd be pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:05

Amazing. I was down um Dartmouth last week and I went to Slapton Sands. I don't know if you've ever heard of that place with the exercise tiger where um a German e-boat torpedoed uh an LST about 15 miles out, and obviously there's a memorial. Um so I was down there and I was doing these, I do these then and now's for the Instagram slash Facebook channel, YouTube, and you know, one you know, standing in Dartmouth. And um somebody put a poster on Facebook and somebody commented also 90th infantry division, and he gave me so much information about this one photo which was pulled from a film. But we standing there with these guys who were boarding uh the ships going to Utah Beach was just like oh wow, it was just sounding, you know, just to be standing in these uh spots where these men were going to battle, they were going across. Yes, and that's mate. It was just I loved it, I love it, mate. Yeah, but mate, I'll leave you to it because uh man, I could talk to you for hours. Um, I just wanted to say thank you so much for having me on. It's been an absolute pleasure. And yes, I would love to connect with your uncle and and find out a little bit more on your grandfather as well, if I can. Um if I can get across here and show you some photos, I'll absolutely do that as well.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:11

That's amazing. Well, I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you for having me as a guest. You know, obviously, thank you for your service and and thank you for doing this podcast uh to just help share people's stories, but also history, um, which I think is very important that we you know continue to hold on to history and learn from history and dissect history um because we can't let it fade away. No, you're right. Um I appreciate what you do, and I I'm very thankful for this opportunity.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:42

No, no, thank you. Absolute honor. The honor is all mine to speak to somebody from of your stature and and your background. I'd say it's a dream come true. Um I never thought in a million years I'd ever get to speak to a navy seal. Um because I I'm in awe of what you guys do, you know. As a Brit, I I think it's like speaking about the training, it's fascinating. I was yeah, it's I love hearing that training side of uh what people go through to achieve, you know, uh you know, to be called a navy seal or an SAS operator, SBS operator, or I just obviously, yeah. Um we do love the training side of things.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:14

Well, I I mean I I appreciate it and I I appreciate the compliments, but you know, I I would just say, you know, in the SEAL teams, like we're no different than anybody else. We just chose a different path. Um, you know, like what my buddy Ray Mendoza taught me is those instructors are no better than us, they just went through it at an earlier time. And in the SEAL teams, I'm no I was and I am still no better than any other service member. I just chose a different way to serve. And it was a little more difficult, but at the end of the day, service is service. And when I was in Ramadi in 2006, we we worked alongside National Guard soldiers and uh Marine Corps units that were attached to them. And I will tell you, and everybody in my task unit felt this way, but I will speak for myself 100%, those National Guard soldiers and the Marines that we fought alongside, and then the 1-1 AD that came in, which was a full-time active duty unit, an armored division, those soldiers as well, were the most brave human beings I've ever worked alongside by far. And so I do appreciate your compliments and the the kind things that you said about me being in the SEAL teams, but it was a job, and I'm thankful for that opportunity, but does not make us any better or any more special than any other service member that decided to serve for their nation and served. So I appreciate it, but I'm also very thankful to every other service member out there that answered the call and every other future service member that will answer the call to continue to keep our nations and this world safe.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:05

No, no, I appreciate that. That's very thoughtful. And yeah, no, I yeah, I couldn't agree more. It's I've read up on the battle, and yeah, that's incredible. Every single one of you who fought in that battle of Ramadi as well is just obviously not just seals, but what you just said there, you know. Um, I read that there was British involved as well. Oh, yeah. Um so I mean that's a whole nother you know rabbit hole to go down and find out which British units are in there. I got a funny feeling who were, but didn't know that. Thought it was predominantly a US battle, but to see that the British were involved, definitely you know, deeper diving to find out, you know, as well. Um but no, no, thank you for that. Uh JP, that was incredible. And Alex L um crack on. But you know, thank you for your time and um thank you. Yeah, look forward to hearing more from you and and being able to hopefully do something for you as well and find out a little bit more from this side of the world for you as well. I mean, yeah, I'd love to do that. Appreciate it. Thank you, JP. Hope you have a good night. Thanks, sir. You too. Bye bye.